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How long until the nano nerf?

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Larkonis Trassler Neo Spartans	Posted - 2008.06.22 12:09:00 - [1] Originally by: Noelle Fay Originally by: Sokratesz Originally by: Kelli Flay lol at this noob. Getting personal because you are afraid they might take your i-win button away? clown. They arent i-win buttons, stop whining. They are either i-win or i-run-away buttons. if you can't handle the enemy, you just run. That's where it's at. You should have a RISK. And don't answer with a "well just get a huginn". ONE ship (or two counting the rapier) ain't a serious counter to something that you can do with ships from all races. Now go away. Apply heavy neutralizer. Tackle and web with fast inty. Primary. Dead nano. Repeat until gang is dead/disengaged. You hold the field. You win. Congratulations. I have been in several fights where I have faced conventional RR BS gangs and they have been able to avoid destruction by holding on the gate, deaggroing, repping each other, and jumping out (see my vid). Does this mean we nerf RR ships due to them being able to disengage with few casualties? No. It means we adapt. We bump them off the gates, we bring more webs, neut them, bring some ECM etc etc. There are many ways to avoid fights if your gang knows what it's doing. I can guarentee if most of the nano gangs you faced were made up of conventional ships you'd still get creamed because these pilots have a clue about what they're doing. Assumption of Risk
Larkonis Trassler Neo Spartans	Posted - 2008.06.22 12:50:00 - [2] Originally by: FORD ESC0RT The vast majority of EVE disagrees with you. Remove Polycarbons and introduce a stacking nerf to overdrives, nanofibers and all velocity related implants. REMOVE snake implants too. all this nonsense about putting together some kind of remote repping bs gang with neutralizers is retarted. you shouldn't need to do this to fight any gang and most people don't have the skills for this. LOL fail. So you are saying in your low skilled cheap noob gang you should be able to take on a highly skilled/experienced/costly nanogang? Like it or not BS gang with RRs and neuts and support are the most effective means of defeating nanos or indeed any other gang outside of a sniper fleet or cap blob. If nanos are nerfed these people will likely come back in Close Range Gank BSes with Heavy Neuts and RRs. They don't exactly take that much to train for. With two low rank skills to level three a BS gang can make an effective sphere where no nanoship will get a tackle on you Assumption of Risk
Larkonis Trassler Neo Spartans	Posted - 2008.06.22 14:01:00 - [3] Originally by: Xeronn oh god , please some nano defender adress the real issue here and not copy/paste the huggin+neut crap Is it ok for ships with significant DPS to disengage at will from any fight ? If by significant DPS you mean 200-400 then I LOL at you sir. A competant conventional gang with some ECM power is just as capable of disengaging. There are many moar ways of dealing with nanos than just Huginns/Heavy Neuts. If you apply some common sense and actually get a grip of your guys and fits then you can take down a good portion of a nano gang before they are able to disengage. Assumption of Risk
Larkonis Trassler Neo Spartans	Posted - 2008.06.22 14:16:00 - [4] Originally by: Venec Here, I'm being nice and posting some quickpatched antinano cerb. Overdrive Injector System II Overdrive Injector System II Nanofiber Internal Structure II Nanofiber Internal Structure II 10MN MicroWarpdrive II Invulnerability Field II Photon Scattering Field II Large Shield Extender II Medium Capacitor Booster II, Cap Booster 800 Standard Missile Launcher II, Flameburst Precision Light Missile Standard Missile Launcher II, Flameburst Precision Light Missile Standard Missile Launcher II, Flameburst Precision Light Missile Standard Missile Launcher II, Flameburst Precision Light Missile Standard Missile Launcher II, Flameburst Precision Light Missile Medium Energy Neutralizer II Warhead Rigor Catalyst I Warhead Rigor Catalyst I Missiles go 8km/s and have explosion velocity of 4,5km/s. Get 5 of them, and in two salvos you will *****most of the nanoships. And if you're insisting on "nano iz bad, rajt?", swap speed mods for ballistics or whatever. Now tell me, what's wrong with this setup? No tackle. Fit point and web. Assumption of Risk
Larkonis Trassler Neo Spartans	Posted - 2008.06.22 14:46:00 - [5] Originally by: Venec This is meant for gang, so for tackling you bring ceptors (and ECM boats, if you're too worried about losing your precious inty's). If you have inties in gang then they should have webs. If they have webs you don't need precision lights. Assumption of Risk
Larkonis Trassler Neo Spartans	Posted - 2008.06.22 16:11:00 - [6] Originally by: baltec1 Alot of these anti nano tactics will not work. 1. snipers. I have a 200km snipoc and a 100km pulse snipoc, both are very good at what they do but are easily made useless by the nano ship simply moving out to 300km. So you need to either get lucky, have a panicing nanonub in your sights or alot of sniper fireing at exactly the same time to get a kill. 2. The Neuting BS. I have a rather nasty geddon setup but it suffers the same problems the sniper does, its slow and cant do anything if the nano ship simply moves out of range 3. intis. Armed with webs a pack of these should be the bane of any nano fleet, but since most nano gangs have webs themselves intis dont last very long to make much of a difference. 4. ECM. Everyone hates it and everyone wants it as part of their fleet but all an ECM boat will do is stop a nano ship from targeting while leaving its speed and ability to warp intact. All are great tool for chasing off nanos but if you want to kill them then your going to need a nano yourself to chase them down. You have all the required blocks here to take out nanos but seem to have the coordination of Michael J Fox with regards to tackling the issue. ECM lays jams on all but a few. Those few stray into your raepsphere of neuts. Inties go and tackle/web. High tracking sniper Pulse Geddons light them up. Rinse and repeat until all nanos are dead/disengage. Assumption of Risk
Larkonis Trassler Neo Spartans	Posted - 2008.06.22 16:31:00 - [7] Originally by: baltec1 as soon as the ECM hits there off out to 300-400km well out of range of anything but nano. My pulse snipoc might have the power of a small star but its useless if they are not in range. This is what we are faced with day in day out. Nano HAC's/recons sitting on a gate 300k out immune to everything in a fleets arsonal. Also going solo means I cannot use all of these things, its this or that. Which means nano will continue to get away from me untill I get my own nano ships. Reading comprehension ftl. Solo, yes you will probably die to a nano gang, you will probably die to a normal gang too. Or to a solo ship with similar skill intensity and cost to a HAC. With heat and a bit of creative thinking you can easily pwn a solo nano ship, at worst drive him off. ECM a few, not all. At 300km they are not hurting you or anyone else. Feel free to disengage. I think the problem people have with nanos is where a competant conventional fleet will try and likely succeed in avoiding confict with a gang that could raep them a nano gang will have a go anyway and if they get nowhere they will disengage. Either situation is the same. Assumption of Risk
Larkonis Trassler Neo Spartans	Posted - 2008.06.22 16:48:00 - [8] Take the average nano gang: Highly experienced, skilled pilots with expensive setups who have probably worked together for some time. Take the average FW gang. Inexperienced, low skilled pilots with cheap setups who have probably never worked together before. Result=Smashed FW gang. Put the nano pilots in a mixed conventional gang with Damage dealers, tacklers, EWAR. Result=Smashed FW gang. It's not nano that's the problem. It's the fact that you are noobs. Assumption of Risk
Larkonis Trassler Neo Spartans	Posted - 2008.06.22 17:14:00 - [9] Originally by: Kelli Flay Thirdly, i presented many arguments and points on why Nano's are unbalanced and the problems they cause for those unprepared and why it is almost impossible to BE prepared for them without nerfing your gang/fleet against most anything else. How is having neut ships, ECM, inties and recons in your fleet nerfing it. This is called balance. A balanced fleet will defeat any other fleet be it made up of snipers, nanos, gank ships or recons. Divided they fall, united they conquer. Assumption of Risk
Larkonis Trassler Neo Spartans	Posted - 2008.06.22 23:55:00 - [10] Originally by: FORD ESC0RT And then they just warp off AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHH That's what fast tacklers are for! If they are 150km away then you can warp off as well. Assumption of Risk
Larkonis Trassler Neo Spartans	Posted - 2008.06.23 00:10:00 - [11] Originally by: Spineker Edited by: Spineker on 23/06/2008 00:00:27 Originally by: Larkonis Trassler Originally by: FORD ESC0RT And then they just warp off AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHH That's what fast tacklers are for! If they are 150km away then you can warp off as well. Tacklers die in route to them how many times must this be explained? We lost 6 interceptor tacklers the other day Wait, so how are these guys tackling your snipers? Because they were idiots and were burning towards the snipers no doubt. Zig zag towards the snipers, it takes longer to get there but they will get there in one piece. I have never had problems tackling snipers in my inties. Failing that, swarm them with T1 tackler frigs. At least some of your clueless drones will make it through the flak. Assumption of Risk
Larkonis Trassler Neo Spartans	Posted - 2008.06.23 01:04:00 - [12] Edited by: Larkonis Trassler on 23/06/2008 01:04:29 Originally by: Spineker Let me wrap it up for you, Nano's decide when where and how to fight they have no fear of dying there is no risk of sitting 150 km away laughing while they decide who to fight who to kill. You can not escape them if they come after you and you certainly can't goddamn lock down 10 of them or even 5. I sometimes sit at a bookmark off gate and warp to it if anything nice comes through. This gives me the opportunity to engage what I want when I want. Do you want to nerf on grid or near grid warping too? Quote: They are well skilled well fitted cruiser class ships running as fast or faster then poorly skilled poorly fitted interceptors they can practically insta pop a badly piloted inteceptor or a gang of poorly coordinated mwd frigs. They will not die unless we adapt our tactics and learn from our errors. We are new to this black art of pvp and require time to adapt so we can better coordinate. Fixed Quote: We risk and we die and we don't have a get of jail free card do we? I'm assuming 90% of this nano hoing happens on gates. Deagress and jump out. OR get your Raepsphere of neuts up and running scare off the tacklers and warp away. Congratulations, get out of jail free card. Quote: Missiles are useless against them, most guns are useless against them no Caldari ship is designed to counter them. ROLL CALL! FALCON ROOK CROW RAPTOR EAGLE CERB BLACKBIRD FEROX VULTURE ROKH SCORPION GRIFFIN Quote: I really am clueless. Fixed Assumption of Risk
Larkonis Trassler Neo Spartans	Posted - 2008.06.23 01:20:00 - [13] Originally by: Spineker Yes you just showed your lack of knowledge in anything regarding this issue and that you are about 10 years old. So instead of making counter arguements you post useless smack? I fly nano ships, I fly non nano ships. Yes nano's are annoying but so are ECM blobs, RR BS Gangs, goonfleet hauler swarms etc etc. Does it mean we nerf them? No. Each has a counter. Nanogangs require a considerable investment it terms of skillpoints, isk and PLAYER EXPERIENCE to be able to work effectively together. The counter to these gangs requires far less in terms of skillpoints and isk but the key factor, the experience, the teamwork that brings it together takes longer to develop. This is what people are failing to realise. These people have been at it longer than you. Once upon the time they were the nubs getting sand kicked in their faces by bullies. Did they whine? No. They picked themselves up, they adapted, they improvised and they overcame. They didn't go running off to the forums to hang on CCP's apron strings. Assumption of Risk
Larkonis Trassler Neo Spartans	Posted - 2008.06.23 02:14:00 - [14] Originally by: Pithecanthropus tools for the job? Lets just turn Eve into Speedracer... weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee. YOU FAIL. You fail to see the direction pvp is going... you fail to see the issue of big ships moving fast... you fail to see anything really. Big ships=!Cruiser and below. Looking at your avatar I think it is you who is the one who is failing to see anything. Assumption of Risk

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